Has Occupy Wall Street Finally Achieved "Joke" Status?

owsangry.jpg
www.funnywallphotos.com
Occupy Wall Street's May Day antics were billed as the resurgence of the Occupy movement. Unfortunately for the occupiers, May Day was widely considered to be a "dud," and has many in the media arguing that the movement has become nothing more than a joke -- just a bunch of "bums" running around New York City complaining about one thing or another.

With yesterday's headline of "OWS Bums Are A Big Joke: Hard workers enjoy a good laugh as May Day skirmishes fizzle," the New York Post is leading the charge.

From the Post:

Occupy Wall Street's call for May Day mayhem largely fizzled yesterday -- but at least provided a good laugh for hardworking people gazing from their office windows at the demonstrators' antics as cops took a few dozen into custody.

"How can anyone take them seriously? They look like homeless people," quipped Financial District bartender Kimberly Leo.

"I saw one woman complaining about not having a job, but she had a shirt with the word "nympho" on it," Leo, 26, said. "These people need a change of wardrobe and a shower."

Reuters, the Daily News, the Associated Press and several other media outlets made similar (although, slightly more subtle) arguments.

We witnessed several of Tuesday's May Day festivities. While not everyone involved in the demonstrations were "bums" (which we pointed out in a post yesterday), the media's take doesn't seem to be too far off -- it's hard to take many of these people seriously when they're  biting cops, dumping buckets of feces in public places, and strolling around New York in Halloween costumes. 

As Susan Ostrowski, a 55-year-old woman who works at a Wall Street insurance company, suggests, it seems some of the occupiers would be better served by "find[ing] jobs and protest[ing] on their time off. They should get involved politically, register to vote rather than sitting and sleeping on the steps in sleeping bags."

As we mentioned yesterday, not all of the occupiers are unemployed hobos. Unfortunately, the non-unemployed hobos involved with Occupy Wall Street get lumped in with the "bums" because the "bums" and their antics get the most ink in the press.

We want to know what you think: has Occupy Wall Street Achieved "joke" status?

Cast your vote below.


My Voice Nation Help
62 comments
nomadnewyork(Adrian)
nomadnewyork(Adrian)

I sure wish that you had reported some actual facts here. Part of the reason that Occupy is a joke is because the media reporting is so completely abysmal. People (see below) who do not understand the facts about Occupy are misinformed because you are keeping them that way.

Thanks for pointing out that we are not "all" bums and drug addicts. Appreciated. 

Occupy is an open movement and reflects America, so yes, some percentage of Americans are bums and drug addicts. The percentage is incredibly small, but you wouldn't know this by what the press reports.

My favorite report came from NJ.com, which reported a dozen people in Bryant Park. 

There are allot of us who have full time jobs, are putting allot of time and energy into this movement and we are mad as hell...Not only at the Corporations that have robbed us blind but we are mad at you, the Press. 

I'm old enough to remember the real Village Voice. I miss it.

Atlas Shrugging
Atlas Shrugging

I don't agree with many of OWS actions (dumping feces, etc) but many of them don't have jobs because they really are few and far between. And some of the reasons they are protesting is because many of the jobs out there max out at 35 hrs per week, have little or no benefits & little or no future. There's not a lot of incentive for them to look like the rest of society that were lucky enough to not be conveniently downsized. what's that I hear , a vast vaccuum of jobs created by handing them to low bid workers outside of the the US in those socialist countries.

nomadnewyork(Adrian)
nomadnewyork(Adrian)

Stop with the dumping feces crap. 

There's also the one guy shitting on a cop car that you folks keep coming up, with no evidence of who this guy is or whether or not he was an occupier or whether or not anyone even wants to be sleeping next to the smell of some guy's shit - oh, and no mention that Occupiers tried to tell the cops, hey someone is shitting on your car, only to be ignored - Why? Because Reporters can't do their jobs. Because the shitting on cop cars story is sensationalism and feeds into the bias against the movement.

Rosewood924
Rosewood924

Dumping feces is not an OWS action.  Does anyone have any actual factual information about the supposed feces dumping incident, by the way?  Anyway, it has nothing to do with what OWS stands for, or what all of us are working for who are involved in the movement.  As for "them looking like the rest of society," I'm not sure what you mean.  The people I know are all different - students, the employed, unemployed, moms, teenagers, elderly, long hair, short hair, beards, clean-shaven, tall, short, thin, fat, gay, straight, piercings, no piercings, tattoos, no tattoos, etc etc etc.  I agree with what you're saying about the scarcity of meaningful work, and the downward spiral created by outsourcing.  What most protesters are concerned about is not their own particular individual situation (although that's often troubling), but more the big picture...They (we) are more worried about the state of our country, and the pain and suffering experienced by, well...the 99%...not just now, but what the picture will look like if things continue as they are.

blindspot
blindspot

This is ridiculous. The very smallest estimates of how many people were there was 20,000 with most estimates being between 25k and 50k people.

Have you seen photos?

There were families, professionals who were not in unions, as well as unions. There were people of all ages, races, religions, and lifestyles.

If we take a low estimate, say there were 10,000 people. If 91 were arrested between May1 and May2, that's a 0.91% crime rate, versus a 2.3% crime rate in NYC in 2011 ( http://bit.ly/JL62wU ).

Look at a picture of Union Square on May Day afternoon. Google pictures of OWS NYC on that day. It was festive, but hardly a joke. This was an actual grassroots community event that a significant number of people identified with, participated in, and enjoyed PEACEFULLY and WITHOUT SPENDING MONEY. We came together, shared, danced, sang.

Readers: Keep believing that major news networks are not biased by their corporate sponsors. Keep thinking that they will not lie to you to keep you from doing a BASIC GOOGLE SEARCH that will show a very different picture from the one they paint.

Village Voice: I am disappointed. Personally, I don't occupy to have fun. I have a job, a stable home, a full scholarship, a research assistant position, I don't use drugs, and I occupy.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO LIKE OCCUPY. BUT PLEASE MAKE A TINY EFFORT TO KNOW WHAT'S REALLY HAPPENING.

Christian Viveros-Faune
Christian Viveros-Faune

James, with all due respect, yours might be the stupidest article I've ever read in the VVoice. We all make mistakes, but "buckets of feces" and a bogus "poll" are basically beneath contempt. Occupy is the one thing that's moved ideas of all kinds forward recently? Don't like it? Phoenix beckons with its spectacular gun and immigration nonsense. Where would you really prefer to live?

Sjkfjakfj
Sjkfjakfj

Another hit piece from the Nazi media.

R.C. Baker
R.C. Baker

As a fellow Voice writer, I think asking whether Occupy Wall Streethas become a "joke" misses the point. Like any large politicalmovement, OWS will include citizens whose sense of decorum upsetsothers both in and outside the group. This is the most sensational butleast interesting aspect of any protest movement. The fact thatthousands of New Yorkers turned out to express their concern and angerover America's growing social inequalities—in a peaceful and civicallyresponsible manner—is the more important observation, because itrepresents a potentially large voting block.

As for running lengthy quotes from the New York Post, it goes without sayingthat the Post, and other NewsCorp entities, are going to attack OWS.Murdoch's empire has been denigrating Occupy's message from the firstmoment it became apparent that many people in America were listeningto the group's most succinct point: that a greater percentage of U.S.wealth is held by a smaller percentage of citizens than ever before,and that this 1%'s manipulation of our political and tax systems—themachinations of which can be clearly seen working in tandem in theSupreme Court's “Citizen United” ruling—works against the interests ofthe vast majority of the populace.

The fact that Occupy's message has taken hold can be seen in theattacks by GOP presidential hopefuls Newt Gingrich and Rick Santorumon Mitt Romney, portraying him as a rapacious Wall Street sharpieconcerned only with short-term profit rather than long-term jobcreation. These debating points were perhaps the most honest momentsof a Republican primary campaign in which Gingrich promised to lowergas prices and multiple-college-degree holder Santorum belittledhigher education—and they would be unthinkable had not OWS firstraised the issues.

Occupy Wall Street is not a joke in any way. One can always argue tactics andstrategies, but the fact is that OWS can be judged, as FDR famouslywas, by who hates and ridicules its progressive message.

Rosewood924
Rosewood924

Repeating myself for the 100th time:  I am 43, a business owner, a homeowner and a mother.  I'm also an Occupier.  I am surrounded by people like me at every action and every General Assembly.Hey, you know why the "bums" get all the press?  Because you're giving them all the press!  Here's an assignment from me to you:  Go talk to the stable, productive people involved in Occupy.  You won't have any trouble finding them.  They're everywhere.

nomadnewyork(Adrian)
nomadnewyork(Adrian)

And I am 52 with 2 grown children, I am a fully employed taxpayer. I am also surrounded by people like me at every action and every General Assembly.

Fuck the press.

crookedE
crookedE

Is this post a joke? If I wanted to read this kind of vitriolic nonsense I would be slogging through the barely literate degenerate comments at nypost.

Emerson
Emerson

The underachieving castoffs of rich white families will destroy the country through Anarchy and then have other people will rebuild it to their always-changing specifications. They themselves won't commit labor because they're artists and thinkers and stuff.

Cindy23
Cindy23

I've always been of the opinion that the owners of the Vilage Voice represents the establishment Democratic party.   A single example would be their columnist Michael Musto; the spokesmouth of the many jewish owned, "gay rights" organizations in the Big Apple.  The Village Voice is simply an "entertainment listings" newspaper that accepts advertising from the many jewish owned businesses in NYC.  A rather large chunk of the VV's revenue comes from "Adult Services" ie. Backpage.com.  Although I don't agree with censorship, I think it's time for people to get behind this campaign to force them to drop Backpage.  Hey if the Democrats can do it to Rush Limbaugh, we can surely organize a boycott of Village Voice adveritsers, now can't we?  If you want more hints, you need to find out why the Village Voice dropped Nat Henthoff as their columnist.

JeffreyJSmith.NewYork@usa.com
JeffreyJSmith.NewYork@usa.com

This article is amazing…and predictable. The old doctrinaire left has NEVER been on the side of OWS. Because OWS has done the one thing both the left and the controlled conservative opposition  NEVER wants...the broad coalition that makes up OWS has broken out of the left-right control mechanism. Once anyone is outside of the control one can see clearly what and who are responsiblefor this nation being in the condition it is. AND you can far more clearly see the true EXTENT ofwhat is going very seriously wrong. OWS is targeting who really running and ruining the country and our world. Look at who OWS has brought together, reform democrats, social democrats, RonPaul supporters, peace activists, Aaron Burr society members, banking reform activists, life longLiberal left activists etc. Now look at who and what OWS has targeted; The six mega banks, TheFederal Reserve, Unelected bureaucrats AND increasingly many parts of OWS have increasingly turned their attention to the Non Governmental Organizations on the upper East Side…and in London the private organizations in which police is actually made and then only rubber stamped in Washington. One OWS’er at May Day called Washington “only the ceremonial center of our government” Think any part of the political control mechanism wants that kind of talk on the street?. And hold on…There’s going to be an army of OWS and other patriotic activists going to next month’s Bilderberg Meeting in Virginia. Yeah, the establishment media wants you to forget about OWS As a serious movement….. JeffreyJSmith.NewYork@usa.com

burning_plastic
burning_plastic

It's really easy to read the story and and see the author's viewpoint, though he does try to mask it in the interest of, you know, journalism and stuff. Then you read what he says in the comments where he has the nerve to use the term bullshit to refer to things other people say.

Be honest and then we can talk about the real issues. It only takes one person to bite a police officer or dump out a bucket of human waste and that doesn't discredit everyone that wants some kind of change. In Oakland protesters burned a US flag. It only took one person to do that but in the news it was a huge story. You say this right in the story but you're clearly not convinced because you use the example of the human waste when you tell us how you really feel in the comments. I appreciate that you are honest there but it makes your story seem like, frankly, bullshit.

I think the problem with OWS is that it really shouldn't be an ongoing thing with no clear goal, because as it loses focus and drags on it is pretty hard to see it as a success. I am glad people have done it, but I think it could have been more effective if it was a planned demonstration set to end at a certain time, but then continuing in other ways. Instead of annoying people blocking the sidewalk, they could work for new ways to do things. That's pretty vague, but occupying an area indefinitely with no conditions or terms set for withdrawal... What are these people, foreign policy experts or what?

Mantelln
Mantelln

What kind of bullsh**t kindergarden truth-twisting press wastes its time on reporting this kind of filth??

F**k you New York Post. Anybody who takes that publication seriously is an idiot.

Its a disgrace that the workplace in America in the 21st Century is not more tolerant of peoples self expression.

If you don't get why these people maintain a radical experience than you are probably ignorant and need to go take a walk down there and actually talk to a few of these people.

Oh, and a fact about life and history. Occupy Wall Streeters ARE involved politically. They have raised tens of thousands of dollars through their efforts, and not used insincere means to generate that wealth, and they put it to good use instead of squandering it on the bullsh*t that mainstream America thinks is so chique and desirable. The clothes most of them wear isn't gotten using child labor, try putting everyone in America in a suit or so-called professional attire and you have what we have today... a bullsh*t system that keeps children in swetashops, poor people looking like tools, and fashion artists struggling for a sincere outlet for their ideas.

Occupy Wall Street has made an enormous political impact within a years time since the movement's inception, AND it looks like they are sustaining their numbers and the struggle. They have created spaces that are actually open for all forms of political discussion, and even maintained a library that ANYBODY can use, without registering for some bunk nationalistic card (oh yeah, the cops illegally destroyed that library and their free wifi system with backing from our so-called politicians and corrupted legal system). The history lesson part is that Anarchists have traditionally boycotted elections in favor of revolution. Many there do vote, but many think we need to totally get rid of these excuses for political leaders we have appointed and the system that keeps them and the corporate fiefdoms in control.

I personally believe in presenting a radical appearance because I believe our homogeneous suit wearing work culture promotes and perpetuates ignorance and cultural imperialism. I am no bum (and I wouldn't ever call anybody such a derogatory term), I hold a management level position at a web software development company, and I'm damn good at what I do and I am on the cutting edge making advances in my field that I feel proud of and know will have a positive impact for everyone.

John Richard Clinton Maenpaa
John Richard Clinton Maenpaa

"You can tell more about a man from what he says about others, than from what others say about him." -Leo Aikman

Woody
Woody

Seriously, James?  

The May Day event in NYC was easily twice the size of the largest OWS march from last October.   Of course, media focused on the 200 people in the "wildcat" march who did less damage than UK students after Kentucky's Final Four victory.   Journalists somehow failed to point out the line of tens of thousands of Occupy participants so long that the march took longer than the official permit had allocated.

OWS was ridiculed from the start as it was changing the national conversation from austerity to wealth and social inequality.  Of course these issues haven't disappeared, but the media chooses to go back to ignoring them:http://www.fair.org/index.php?...

James, I know it isn't as headline grabbing, but maybe you can focus on poverty being the highest in NYC since 2005 instead of articles such as the one on an NJ mom taking a 5 year olds tanning.  Thanks for the hard hitting journalism.  

Angela Garcia as NeonMosfet
Angela Garcia as NeonMosfet

OWS has always been a joke. They don't seem to get it. Main Street caused the market to crash. What else is OWS but, Location, Location, Location. Back in '07, before Bear Sterns, went into extinction, people would do ANYTHING to live in THAT neighborhood, figuring they could refinance their dogs of a mortgage. Some were just planning to flip their properties for profit, and then flip again, and then flip again, not realizing, people will pay only so much for an outhouse. Once that ceiling is reached, that's it. They were then stuck holding the plunger.  Then, were those, who really were earning a toxic income. They went to mortgage brokers, who were able to get them into that dream home with creative financing, which was then presented to the banks, the real ones. Incomes were listed in Deutsch Marks to make them more attractive. A lot of them got money back at closing, which was added to the mortgage. No one thought anything amiss, because these were presented as the primary home, with a monthly payment, that was cheaper than rent. " I just did everything ******** said, and got forty thousand back at closing." And what? They spent their 40gs on Slumberger, Apple, and Coca Cola, right? No one thought all the balloons were going to come crashing down at the same time. The Bear died. Fannie and Freddie were in deep trouble.  Next came Lehman Brothers. What no one knew? Barclays Bank want to buy them at a fire sale. At 7am, On a Monday in October, Lehman's was still breathing. At 7:01 am, Barclay's had cut their proverbial throats, knowing full well that no one could sell off, to recoup some of their losses, for another hour. Then someone started the panic, that WaMu ( Washington Mutual ) stock was in trouble. All their customers pulled their money on Friday. On Monday, WaMu was history. Bernie Maidoff? Icing on the cake.

Angela Garcia as NeonMosfet

Marcos Anderson
Marcos Anderson

 Why not? It's already achieved the "Rape" and "Murder" Status

Ian A. Brand
Ian A. Brand

This is indicative of the execrable "reporting" the Voice has turned out since it was sold to a conglomerate. All the intelligent reporters were fired or left and we are left ultimately with this insulting nonsense: truly a waste of money to pay people to write this drivel.

o3
o3

the teapartiers got their msg across w/o squatting on public property & fighting police so OWS can do the same.

diceytroop
diceytroop

"As [I] mentioned yesterday, not all of the occupiers are unemployed hobos. Unfortunately, the non-unemployed hobos involved with Occupy Wall Street get lumped in with the "bums" [by me] because the "bums" and their antics get the most [pageviews for the blog I should probably quit before I ruin]."

This next one, I'm not gonna fix for you:

"the media's take doesn't seem to be too far off -- it's hard to take many of these people seriously when they're are biting cops, dumping buckets of feces in public places, and strolling around New York in Halloween costumes. "

First of all, news flash: *you're the media, buddy!* And who the fuck is "they're" ? 50,000 people were biting cops? No. I don't even remember hearing about someone biting a cop, nevermind more than one, and the odds are if you heard it it was because a cop jammed their hand into someone's mouth. And that other thing had nothing to do with OWS. And our costumes are fun, dammit.

Listen: stop pretending you're *not* trying to do a hit piece here, and then top it off with a poll. Take responsibility for your actions.

xavier
xavier

The voice has long since become a tool for the corporate order.

Fuck you Village Voice, you irrelevant rag.

I only came here for the classified ads, and saw this hit piece.

James King
James King

Shit -- you guys are on to us. We're in the pockets of the corporate fat-cats. Rather than just ignore the people biting cops and dumping buckets of feces and urine out in lower Manhattan -- or the droves of "bums" (New York Post's words, not ours) trying to change the world by sleeping on a sidewalk -- we're pointing out that they're acting like fucking idiots and giving the Occupy movement a bad name. What were we thinking?

Mantelln
Mantelln

Dude, you should think about the shit you are saying and how irrelevant to important issues and culturally biased your opinions are and how press like this is worthless.

Back in the good old days of America, people would have shot those cops and burned the banks (if good old Americans hadn't been such racist imperialists...).

Sleepin on the sidewalk can make a difference, btw. Some kid sees that and thinks, wow fuck all you lame punk assed suits, I wanna drop out! Why should people work so hard in this country when half of the work is bullshit designed to make some douche bag you don't agree with rich, and the other half goes to killing or enslaving people in developing countries to make some other douche bag rich?

James King
James King

Yes! Thank you so much for that comment -- you just made my point for me. Sleeping on the sidewalk makes a difference because it could inspire a hypothetical kid to drop out of school -- that's priceless. I owe you a drink. Shoot me an email at jking@villagevoice.com.

jnbstraight
jnbstraight

Youre giving the enemy ammunition and they then say "see, even the liberal village voice is throwing OWS under the bus!" 

diceytroop
diceytroop

The fact that you want to equate 50,000 people with one or two dumbasses is obviously in bad faith; that you'd term it "calling a spade a spade" is infuriating. Don't ignore those facts or anything to push your agenda, though.

Christopher Neal
Christopher Neal

James you are my new hero. Nice Integrity, in all seriousness...

James King
James King

Yes, by me. If something is bullshit, I will call it bullshit. If other Voice writers want to ignore facts to push their political agenda, that's on them. I'm sorry, I won't try to glorify people sleeping on the street and dumping shit in public just so you agree with me.

diceytroop
diceytroop

By you, while other VV writers with brains blatantly contradict your made-up nonsense.

James King
James King

 This isn't the "liberal Village Voice." This is the Village Voice. Bullshit will be called bullshit regardless of political affiliation.

jnbstraight
jnbstraight

What the fuck is wrong with the Voice for running articles like this? Are you guys trying to get Goldman Sachs back as investors? 

RLXPRESS
RLXPRESS

The joke is on US! the powers that be will have you laugh at the gutter punks out there getting slapped around by the boys in blue. While the economic & social slope continues to get slipperier. Yes, a few of these kids are to social outcasts, but the problems are the same, and the people laughing are the ones who are going to feel it in the end...with no vaseline I might add. #Sad&True

M Decci
M Decci

"and the people laughing are the ones who are going to feel it in the end"

And how will that be? The only thing that can make them "feel it" was if some brutal bolchevike type revolution, came and disposed them of their earnings and free willing market exercise, by force... is that what you want?

jnbstraight
jnbstraight

That's not what I was drivng at. When they see more of their salaries decrease while productivity increases, further stock market manipulation, ceo pay blossoming to over 400 times that of it's average worker, health benefits gone along with their jobs overseas while the superrich get richer and bigger tax breaks then they are going to say "huh, maybe they had a point?" Not as if the fucking biggest economic crash since the great depression and the US starting to resemble Victorian England in terms of its disparotity in wealth didnt tell them that already. 

Banks dont play by the free market. if they did they wouldnt even be in existence right now since most of them went broke and had to loot the treasury for almost a trillion dollars and then have the balls to cry "its socialism!" when people need healthcare or some mortgage relief.

Thanks for playing.

24AheadDotCom
24AheadDotCom

 Let's assume you're right. Then, shouldn't we blame the leaders (frontpeople and real leaders) for being either dumb or fake? If OWS weren't the people they are, they could have prevented the very large number of self-discrediting loons from making the 1% of OWS who aren't loud loons look bad.

P.S. One of the top OWS promoters is also a mbr of a Rckfllr group. And, the immig. position of OWS is basically the same as lbrtarins, big banks, big biz, etc. etc. Whether they're intentionally fake or not, they should be treated as fake.

nomadnewyork(Adrian)
nomadnewyork(Adrian)

There are no leaders. There is no membership card. We can not keep anyone from showing up in a park or showing up at a demonstration. 99% of OWS are not loud loons that look bad, but you wouldn't know that because you read the NY Post and the Village Voice.

Al Swearengen
Al Swearengen

How exactly are the OWS people supposed to prevent the crazy people from exercising their freedom of speech?  They don't have a huge fascistic storm trooper army for cracking heads like the 1%.

24AheadDotCom
24AheadDotCom

P.S. Here's OWS being on the same side as Bloomberg, Koch, etc. etc. (sorry, you'll have to remove the spaces):

24ahead . com/n/10874

OWS is the "anti-elite" group whose position is basically the same as the elites on an issue where the elites are weakest. They're either fake or dumb, choose whichever you're most comfortable with.

24AheadDotCom
24AheadDotCom

P.S. Here's OWS being on the same side as Bloomberg, Koch, etc. etc.:

24ahead.com/n/10874

OWS is the "anti-elite" group whose position is basically the same as the elites on an issue where the elites are weakest. They're either fake or dumb, choose whichever you're most comfortable with.

24AheadDotCom
24AheadDotCom

I started a (so far very unsuccessful) pro-borders group on FB. The first thing I did was lay out what the group was about, the ground rules, and the very effective way the group was going to pursue its objective.

All OWS started with was a whine, which then proceeded to the brilliant idea to act like Cub Scouts in public parks. They never came up with a code of conduct that would help them say, "this person is not OWS and doesn't represent us". Their belief in direct democracy (something the US has never had, and by design) means everyone has the same pull as anyone else.

So, basically, not foreseeing that they'd be a crazy magnet and taking steps to mitigate it shows they aren't fit to lead much of anything.

xavier
xavier

 Don't follow the stupidity of the coporate media. There were plenty of respectable (whatever that means) people there.

To me respectable people are the ones who don't buy the bulshit of Wall Street and their lapdog servants.

jnbstraight
jnbstraight

indeed. this was essentially the way Nixon and the right wing media treated Vietnam protesters but lo and behld the war really was a slaughterhouse and polarized the country for the next four decades. They wont be laughing when the future that's coming bites them in the ass. 

Matt Graber
Matt Graber

I think it's worth questioning the premise in the headline which suggests that OWS hadn't already reached joke status, before it's reappearance on Tuesday. Back when Zuccotti Park was their home, I took a walk over there to see what it was all about. What I saw were these same types of people (dirty, sketchy, unemployable) that have of course taken precedence to the more clean cut protesters in terms of media ink. My impression was that these gutter punks had flocked from all over the country to join the fun, probably ruining everything for the people that SHOULD be the faces of the movement (the hardworking but underemployed). 

But how can this be avoided? It's no different from the Tea Party being perceived by us enlightened liberal New Yorkers as a bunch of backward bigots, because of a few colorful characters. Am I out of line in drawing the comparison? Not between the movements so much as the media portrayal of the movements, and the undesirables that we tend to focus our sights on. 

M Decci
M Decci

The 2 groups are non-comparable even if both had protesters. The TP percieved as hillbillies bigots was debunked by the bastion of "entlightment" newspaper, the NYT no less when they published the demographic profile of the Partiers. Most educated, middle to high incomers, more in tune with the typical suburban american than the OWS or even the minority "enlightened" nothern liberal.

Am not a TP, their positions on fiscals are too radical even for a Fiscal Conservative like me; but it doesnt blind me from admitting their effectiveness as a political force. In difference to the OWS, the TPs knew EXACTLY what they wanted; how to organize to achieve their goals, and those goals were not only achievable but backed up by the law. When they said "we want less taxes" or "we oppose obamacare" you know exactly what that means whether you agree or not with those positions. They are firm, explicit, objective and solid. They are achievable by replacing the individuals in government that support those policies by others who dont and it is lawful thing to do.

But these OWS are just plain old subjective rethoric based on their own anguishes and not based on logic, or laws, or realities. You simply cant say "I want a 'fairer' world'...because that is subjective - fairness according to whom? - or blame 'Wall Street' because you bought a house you couldnt affor to pay...or blame the Koches while celebraring the Hollywood stars with your Ipad in hand...; saying that 1% has lots of money doesnt justify by the law, to simply go and take it, etc.  

Al Swearengen
Al Swearengen

Fairness is millionaires paying the same fucking tax rates as the rest of us.  Is that so hard to  understand, genius?

Stop being a willfully ignorant idiot.

MarcabianFleetCommander
MarcabianFleetCommander

How then do you feel about the multi-million dollar corporations who paid NO TAXES? These same corporations, who, by the way, are happily outsourcing U.S. jobs? Are you really surprised that people would take issue with this?

edo
edo

Millionaires pay more than you. Try actually looking up the facts. The top 10% pay 70% of all taxes. Guess what the bottom 50% pay? Nothing or next to nothing. Google national Taxpayers Union to find out the truth. 

Angela Garcia as NeonMosfet
Angela Garcia as NeonMosfet

In actuality, a millionaire pays THIRTY FIVE PERCENT in income tax. But, as with  yourself, they only pay tax in the year that the money was earned. If they still have that money into the next fiscal year, they pay no tax. Because as you and I know, you don't pay tax, two times, on the same money. You pay tax on the INTEREST, which because all of YOU made the banks fail, because all of YOU had to live ALL WHITE, amounts to squat. If any of you had bank accounts, you would pay the same tax as the millionaire, ZIP. If YOUR tax bill seems high, it's because you pay social security and medicaid. That's not a hand out. That's your savings account.  Unfortunately, most people have a sick need to believe in heroes and magic. What does a Republican believe?  Heroes and magic, but it is only for them. They believe in being 1% but only for them. The problem is not Wall Street; the problem is the Republican Party.

Angela Garcia as NeonMosfet

smarterthanyouraveragelibetard
smarterthanyouraveragelibetard

Just a quick math lesson... a millionaire pays and effective tax rate on his $20 million in earnings of 15% (thanks to capital gains tax laws, which apply to anyone who invests their money, not just millionaires).  His secretary pays the same rate on the $40,000 she earned salary.  Who paid more?  The millionaire would pay $3,000,000.  the secretary would pay $6,000.  That means that the millionaire paid 500 times more in taxes than his secretary.  Now, last year I made $25,000.  I am, by no means, rich.  I guess that puts me in the "99%" category, but I cannot, for the life, of me understand what is so unfair about this.  Granted, I oversimplified it a bit, but I think you get my point. The top ten percent income earners pay something like 75% of all tax revenue.  How is increasing that fair?

Emerson
Emerson

Fairness would also be for social service parasites to not milk the system when they are capable of working. The 1% has nothing to do with the super-rich. It's a class-warfare ploy where anybody with less can resent anyone else who has more. At this rate ANYONE dumb enough to work and not mooch will be considered the 1%.

NewsDog
NewsDog

Fairness is available. Get a good CPA.

James King
James King

Good point, Matt. I totally agree. Not all of these occupiers are unemployed drug addicts the same way not all the Tea Partiers are racist hillbillies. The problem is it's the drug addicts and the hillbillies who get all the ink -- giving the movements as a whole a bad name.

MGraber
MGraber

Right, and for obvious reasons having to do with media and it's love of the profane and the base. Importantly, I feel like it's up to the people within the movement to temper this type of thing (people biting cops, sending envelopes with mysterious powder, and other idiotic acts.) It's up to them to maintain some kind of discipline within their rank and file. In my neighborhood, Red Hook, one badly worded email by an affiliate of the local Occupy group resulted in the cancellation last week of what could have been a productive meeting between local cops and the community. The email, which was not approved by a majority of the group, invited outside organizations to come to the meeting to protest stop and frisk policy, which led the police to cancel. It's just a small example of how one person's bad idea or ill-advised action can spoil things for everyone else. It's unfortunate.

Mattgraber84
Mattgraber84

but to answer your question, yes i think any movement or organized group has a certain amount of control over their image in media, and some responsibility to denounce certain actions taken in their name if those actions do not represent the group's interests or philosophy. obviously it's impossible to enforce that kind of thing completely, but i still think it's something to consider as the movement moves forward. 

Mattgraber84
Mattgraber84

I'm not dooming anybody, just expressing an opinion. What's with the hyperbolic rhetoric that pro-occupy people seem to find so irresistible? How bout making a point and letting the point carry it's own weight? 

DanShockley
DanShockley

So, because U.S. media and lazy, ill-informed couch potatoes focus on the sensational and non-representative actions, any group of activists has to maintain extremely rigid control over everyone even loosely affiliated?

Oh, I get it. You basically are dooming us to the status quo, either intentionally or out of ignorance. "If the people who want to make things better aren't absolutely perfect, I can go back to sleep, instead of feeling obligated to take action myself."

Now Trending

New York Concert Tickets

From the Vault

 

Loading...