*

Who gives a fuck, This is a bunch of fat ass people that are too lazy to do anything trying to tell someone they can't use substances to better themselves. Fuckin Retarted. That is why steroids are legal in almost every other country. You don't see people falling over and dying, just the media talking a bunch of bullshit.

Ann,
Can't you make your point without the profanity? Try growing up and using big girl words!

Steroids are good for you just ask Lyle Alzado

Ahhh Ann,
Steroids are against the rules in every Major sport in the WORLD.

Lock 'em all up ... especially FAT BOY Clemens.

>You don't see people >falling over and >dying, just the
>media
>talking a bunch of >bullshit.

right. my guess is that the only retard here is the one who speaks about things they know nothing about... right "Ann" ?

Here's just a short list of athletes who've died from steroid side effects (and their ages)

Florence "FloJo" Joyner - 39
Lyle Alzado - 43
Jesse Marunde - 27
Tevor Smith - 33
Louise Halliwell - 38
Mike Scarcella - 39
Dan Duchaine - 48
Mohammed Benaziza - 33
Andreas Munzer - age??
Sonny Schmidt - 50
J. Kyle Braid - 16
Ed “The Bull” Gantner - 30

and a slew of Pro Wrestlers:
--------------
Chris Von Erich - 21
Mike Von Erich - 23
Louie Spiccoli - 27
Art Barr - 28
Gino Hernandez - 29
Jay Youngblood - 30
Rick McGraw - 30
Joey Marella - 30
Ed Gatner - 31
Buzz Sawyer - 32
Crash Holly - 32
Kerry Von Erich - 33
D.J. Peterson - 33
Eddie Gilbert - 33
The Renegade - 33
Chris Candido - 33
Adrian Adonis - 34
Gary Albright - 34
Bobby Duncum Jr. - 34
Owen Hart - 34
Yokozuna - 34
Big Dick Dudley - 34
Brian Pillman - 35
Marianna Komlos - 35
Emory Hale - 36
Leroy Brown - 38
Mark Curtis - 38
Eddie Guerrero - 38
John Kronus - 38
Davey Boy Smith - 39
Johnny Grunge - 39
Vivian Vachon - 40
Jeep Swenson - 40
Brady Boone - 40
Terry Gordy - 40
Bertha Faye - 40
Billy Joe Travis - 40
Chris Benoit - 40
Larry Cameron - 41
Rick Rude - 41
Randy Anderson - 41
Bruiser Brody - 42
Miss Elizabeth - 42
Big Boss Man - 42
Mike Awesome - 42
Biff Wellington - 42
Brian Adams (Crush) - 43
Ray Candy - 43
Nancy Benoit - 43
Dino Bravo - 44
Curt Hennig - 44
Bam Bam Bigelow - 45
Jerry Blackwell - 45
Junkyard Dog - 45
Hercules - 45
Andre the Giant - 46
Big John Studd - 46
Chris Adams - 46
Mike Davis - 46
Hawk - 46
Dick Murdoch - 49
Jumbo Tsuruta - 49
Rocco Rock - 49
Sherri Martel - 49
Moondog Spot - 51
Ken Timbs - 53
Uncle Elmer - 54
Pez Whatley - 54
The Angel of Death - 54
Eddie Graham - 55
Tarzan Tyler - 55
Haystacks Calhoun- 55
Giant Haystacks - 55
The Spoiler - 56
Kurt Von Hess - 56
Moondog King - 56
Gene Anderson - 58
Dr. Jerry Graham - 58
Bulldog Brown - 58
Tony Parisi - 58
Rufus R. Jones - 60
Ray Stevens - 60
Stan Stasiak - 60
Terry Garvin - 60
Boris Malenko - 61
Little Beaver - 61
Sapphire - 61
Shohei Baba - 61
Dick the Bruiser - 62
Wilbur Snyder - 62
George Cannon - 62
Karl Krupp - 62
Dale Lewis - 62
Gorilla Monsoon - 62
Hiro Matsuda - 62
Bad News Brown - 63
Bulldog Brower - 63
Wahoo McDaniel - 63

Lyle Alzado did not die from steroids, is own Dr admitted. He died of brain cancer. The DEA and the AMA were against making steroids a banned controlled substance.

I would suggest that when the entire report is online, search for the words complicit, tacit approval and other similar words related to management's role in this affair. Don't forget that there was collusion between major league baseball owners in the past in dealing with player salaries. Not once, but TWICE. After baseball player strikes, The league has continued to make more money than ever. How else can a career .225 hitter can get make, on average, more than a million dollars a year. Just about all the emphasis is being placed on the players. Let's see if Selig, as an owner and commissioner will get the proverbial "pass". Let's also see if this report makes it clear that some substances used were NOT illegal at the time it was used. Will this report tell us if substances were used while illegal? And will it prove it? Obviously there were players involved in the name of lengthening their careers. Just remember management's role in this sh*t. Keep in mind that Hall of Fame votes are placed by sports writers, many of whom carry personal grudges against players. They will certainly "use" this against any particular player based on this report, regardless of where there is solid proof. Let's hope the truth, one way or the other, will come out. After all, it is stranger than fiction.

Thanks for your time,

Kevin

NO HALL OF FAME
CANCEL CY YOUNG AWARDS
LIFETIME BAN FROM BASEBALL

ann, you are retarded.. you can not deny the affect that steroid use has, not only on the health of adult users, but also the perception of the drug that is projected onto younger generations by their idols. steroids are dangerous, they kill people and they cheat the integrity of the game. Im sure you are one of those idiots that insists that steroids dont help you break records either.

Flo-Jo did not die from steriod use. Please provide concrete evidence, if you have it.

Also Andre the Giant suffered from a disease, of which, made him the 'giant' that he was.

Thanks,

I'm sure it's a HUGE COINCEDENCE that there are no Boston Red Sox players listed and Mitchell is CURRENTLY on the board of directors for THE BOSTON RED SOX!!! NO CONFLICT OF INTEREST THERE!!!

The team ownes and the management of MBL are scum too. they ruined the game with these roid freaks. Ruth, Williams, DiMaggio, Mantle, Aaron, Mays, Maris and others did not use roids. If Ted Williams had not served in the military twice - he would have had over 700 home runs.

I rhetorically asked my teenage son, "What's the difference between Clemens and Bonds? (before he knew of the report)He said, "One's white."
We will see if that difference matters now , won't we?

>Flo-Jo did not die
> from steriod use.

right. And Marion Jones never did steriods either all those years where she tested negative.

I suppose the seizures that FloJo suffered from just happened. And those body changes between 1984 (when she was a nobody) to 1988 (when she suddenly dominated) were natural... Look at the facial changes.

>Also Andre the Giant
>suffered from a
>disease, of which,
>made him the 'giant'
>that he was.

In several interviews, Hulk Hogan (who himself has admitted to abusing steroids in the past) said that Andre suffered from Acromegaly. He also said that Andre used massive amounts of steroids to help him recuperate from injuries.
Hogan said that the combination of the 2 were what brought The Giant down.

... any other questions?

Steroids are great for performance improvement and injuries. I have taken them in the past myself (when I was young and stupid). They definetly are dangerous when abused, just like alcohol and tabacco, or any other drug. They have no place in any sport, they are for cheaters, I have personally seen 6 people that I have known over the past years commit suicide or die from them, and these are just regular Joes. I say that all users should be punished. I wonder how many will have the balls to admit to taking them?

Actually, Jason Varitek's name was listed as a possibility.

view the report here http://assets.espn.go.com/media/pdf/071213/mitchell_report.pdf

Giminy crickets, I'm aghast, horrified, mortified and stupefied, but certainly not surprised. "...Oh what a tangled web we weave..." the Bard would have reiterated.

Von Erichs committed suicide

>"What's the difference
>between Clemens and
>Bonds? (before he
>knew of the report)
>He said,
>"One's white."
>We will see if that
>difference matters
>now , won't we?

actually. no. Because Bonds isn't being charged with taking steroids. He's being charged with lying to federal prosecuters.
if Clemens did the same, then he would have been brought up on charges too.

so, you can't play the race card on this one.

... any other questions?

Yes.

You have quite a list of wrestlers and wrestling personalities there. I think you are on some drugs yourself if you would have me believe that every dead individual who has a tie to wrestling in the last 50 years has "died from steroid side effects."

Owen Hart plunged to his death in the ring.

Bigelow died of non-steroidal drug overdose.

Haystacks Calhoun weighed over 600 pounds and had lost a leg to diabetes before his death.

Sherri Martel? Hillbilly heroin.

Gorilla Monsoon lived to be 62...died of heart failure / diabetes.

I would guess, at a glance, that more than 50% of your list is crap. That isn't to say that there aren't a ton of steroid users in wrestling, but just because they were in the business and died young doesn't mean they died of steroids.

I'm not saying Owen Hart did not use drugs, but that obviously was not the cause of his death...

As far as Clemens, it's really a shame because pitchers in general are under-represented in the Hall of Fame.

I KNEW Roger Clemens was on fucking steroids. Clemens sucks compared to Maddux or Glavine.

>... but just because
> they were in the
>business and died
>young doesn't mean
>they died of steroids.

actually, that list was taken from the US federal probe's report into the WWE and steroids (then the WWF).
In the report, Those listed has side effects from steroids as a contributing cause on their death certificates.

Heroin won't kill you. Heroin works on the central nervous system. The heroin abusers heartbeat slows as well as their breathing. They may loose consciousness. Any of these effects can be fatal if the dose is too high.

So, you could say that nobody every dies from Heroin overdoses. They die of the effects that the overdose has on their hearts.

it's just symantics really.

Using that logic, I guess nobody dies from Steroids either. Just the multitude of side effects that abuse causes.

actually, that list was taken from the US federal probe's report into the WWE and steroids (then the WWF).

When was this "federal probe"'s report issued? Where can it be found?

Way to be the judge and jury on some third party hearsay... Classless atempt at writing. Let's wait and see how this all pans out.

Steroids are not benign.
They are for cheaters.

Some of the drugs were technically "legal" or not banned at the time of use for some, but that does not make it right.

There seems to be a serious conflict of interest in the report in concern to the Red Sox being under represented and that is in part because the two major snitches were from NY.

Not all the wrestlers on the crazy list (Ms. Elizabeth??) died from steroids but you can bet many many of them were adversely effected for sure.

The best comment I saw was about the owners tacit acceptance, they are equally at fault in this situation and it's amazing how rarely that is acknowledged. Also the sports writers. They loved the stories about the homeruns, superstars and age defying feats. They relayed the exploits with drool and hype to help create this environment znc fans loved it and demanded more. Yes the players did the wrong things, but they were part of a system that almost encouraged them to do so. Results oriented, bottom line, mega salaries and commercial endorsements, movie star status, extra excitement over homeruns and one hundred mile an hour fastballs, cultural lust for muscle. Somehow the image baseball tries to hold on to, a 1950's legacy of America's game and honor and fairness becomes understandably faded.

Interestingly it seems many of the players took them late in their careers to overcome injuries or the realities of age. It's hard not to imagine taking a little bit to overcome an injury when you're 40 and trying to win a championchip.

Would you turn down 10 million dollars, acclaim and adoration for a little bit of "medicine"?. How many American's have tried illegal drugs once or even slightly overuse legal ones?

Lastly, don't assume all listed are guilty. There is no trial here or burden of proof but there is much heresay.

All said, those who enhanced their performance with drugs are still cheaters, misguided, and certainly don't deserve our attention.

The fact is the country has it in for Bonds. Charging him for perjury while Raphael Palmiero pointed his finger and lied about his steroid use to Congress and was caught a year later with a positive steroid test but no Grand Jury indictment for him? Hmmm....

>The fact is the
>country has it in
>for Bonds. Charging
>him for perjury
>while Raphael
>Palmiero pointed his
>finger and lied
>about his steroid
>use to Congress and
>was caught a year
>later with a
>positive steroid
>test but no Grand
>Jury indictment for
>him? Hmmm....

Probably not, because a Congressional hearing (for all it's bluster) does not have the same legal teeth as a Federal Grand Jury.

Lying to congress happens all the time. For example: The cigarette companies did it for 30-40 years... with impunity.
It took private class action lawsuits to bring the truth about cigarette smoking's link to cancer.

Palmero didn't lie to Federal Prosecuters, nor to a Grand Jury.... he only lied to Congress.

If Congress actually cared about people lying to them, then Presidents Nixon, Regan, Clinton and Bush would all have been spending their twilight years in jail.

OK.........If one more ACLU asshole brings up the non-existant analogy of Clemens vs. Bonds I am going to puke!!!!!!

Helloooooooooooooo!!!!

Bonds is not being charged with steriod use. As Mitchell said today, no one ever is. He is being charged as the lying scumbag that he is when he lied to the GRAND JURY!!!

As for the NAACP....if you want a tangeble reality with a white guy, how about Pete Rose? He lied and paid the price,just as bary will do.

So, what does the captain #2 have to say about half his team getting caught. He'sd just happy he wasn't caught too!!!!!!

Don't you all get it?
It's obvious.
The media and fan refused to pay attention to Clemens just because he's a white American.
Don't act like you never suspected him.
He bulked up just like Bonds did.
And also there were a report in some newspaper that Clemens was juiced up.
But then again, no other media made a big deal out of it.
Well, it is and should have been a big deal.

He stoled 7 CY awards!!!
Hypocrates!!!

Steriods are illegal. Baseball player are human. A punishment is in order. But even before these players juiced they where still great ballplayers with or without the juice. Punish them but don't ban them it's not like they were killing dogs.

Just want to reiterate that Michael is full of crap. He says his list was taken by the federal probe of steroid use in the WWE (then the WWF). The WWF became the WWE in 2002, and Michael's list includes Chris Benoit.

Benoit died in 2007. So what was his name doing on a list of steroid related deaths that was compiled in 2002 at the latest?

You also have the Junkyard Dog listed. JYD died in a car accident on the way home from his daughter's graduation. Many people die in car accidents. Few are as a result of steroids.

Let's see if Clemens will get special treatment because he's a fat white boy. Marion Jones was stripped of her records. He should not get into the Hall of Fame!!

Man oh Man!

The party of controversy is just starting.

But will all will be forgot by Opening Day.

Pretty clever, eh?

Jim Bouton discusses the report here:

http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/archives/2007/12/_village_voice.php

So much for his legendary work outs; must have meant his legendary mooning....hhahahha

Who gives a fuck about steroids in baseball. Theres a god damn war going on, the economy is in the shitter, the dollar value has gone down and there is a housing crash.
The Bush Administration has once again proved how big of a circus it is. RON PAUL FOR PRESIDENT!

Whatever ... Yankees on steroids are still better than the Mets

i have a different purview of the issue clemen----cy

There will always be jackasses who defend steroids. There will also be other jackasses who bring up race. The white ones blame it on the black ones and vice versa. It's no-win. And poor Ann. Darling? Do you eat with that filthy mouth? I certainly wouldn't let you put it on me. Grow up and use appropriate tone and language (that goes for the rest of you too!).

Hugz and Kisses to All you Sports Fans. I know I'm one and I get all jazzed up too with the hype and the "oh no you didn't!".

If one has to use controlled substances to enhance one's performance then what on the Good Lord's Earth is natural about one or one's performance? Nothing. But, I guess using the muscles and brains the Creator gave you isn't good enough. The honor of good sportsmanship is gone I fear. Let's all lie and cheat and it will be a better world!!!!!!